Dodge Caliber Forum banner
1 - 16 of 16 Posts

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,348 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Don't remember anyone picking up on this so here's the announcement:


FEV - a powertrain and vehicle engineering firm headquarted in Aachen, Germany.

FEV announced that it will show a range-extended electric vehicle (ReEV) with plug-in capability based on the Dodge Caliber platform at the 2009 SAE World Congress in Detroit (April 20-23, 2009).

The Caliber ReEV's propulsion system employs a 1.0-liter, 3-cylinder, 4 valve engine mated to a UQM PP75 generator that provides 41kW of continuous power in extended-range mode, with a peak power of 75kW.

The energy generated is stored in a 20 kW-h liquid-cooled Lithium Ion battery pack that operates at 346V, with a Delphi DC/DC converter. FEV said that the batteries provide enough power for the car to cover a distance of 40 miles or 64 kilometers which seems to be the magic number for most vehicles of the sort... The Caliber ReEV can accelerate from zero to 60mph (96km/h) in 8.3 seconds and has a top speed of 84mph or 135 km/h.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,348 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,302 Posts
Right now the only real holdback is the cost of the batteries. Once that is solved, practical short-range plug-in vehicle can become a reality, not a technical curiosity.

I'm really not sure if hybrids really make much sense, though. They have very complex systems, high initial cost, low return on investment.

Straight battery power would definitely make a good "local errand runner". But, for the forseeable future, internal combustion engines are probably the best method of powering automobiles for long distance travel.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,348 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
The initial push for Hybrids here was as a Smog measure to allow zero emission operation for inner city traffic, and gasoline for range out of town.

The Insight takes a different approach running on a small efficient gasoline engine all the time, with a battery/electric motor available as a boost to supplement the engine when more performance is called on. Other than appealing to Hybrid types what is the benefit over a turbo, or diesel, or just having an economical car to begin with.

The new Honda is attractive though the covered rear wheel on the first generation appealed to my Citroen tastes. It's the best selling car in Japan.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,302 Posts
They're so tiny though - Looks as if the one in my neighborhood could be parked in my hatc area - without folding down the rear seats.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,622 Posts
Have you seen "Who Killed the Electric Car?" documentary? Martin Sheen narrates the coverage of the EV-1 made by GM in the early 90's. It's very interesting to see what they are capable of making, compared to what we actually will see. The technology is here to make it very practical, but certain parties are keeping things under control to profit themselves.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,302 Posts
The only thing "killing" the electric car is the battery system. Motors, controllers, drivetrain components have been well developed for years.

There is no conspiracy, or "hidden agenda" out there - the real problem is to develop a lightweight, high capacity, long-life, low cost battery pack.
The first three have pretty much been done, the fourth one (cost) is still being worked on.
Producing something at an acceptable cost without sacrificing important features is a very difficult thing to do.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,348 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Have you seen "Who Killed the Electric Car?" documentary?
Who Crushed the Electric Car ?





I think the issue then was that they were leased due to service life of batteries and it was too expensive for GM.
Does look very familiar to the first Insight ...


Once upon a time, there was an electric car. It was built by a major American automaker, and its original version could go 95 miles on a charge of electricity. Its second generation could go 140 miles on a charge. In fact, it was so successful at what it was designed to do, that the automaker took them all back, refused to allow anyone to buy one for themselves, and scrapped them.

The incredible true story is told in the independent film, Who Killed The Electric Car? It's the story of the EV-1, built by General Motors in an attempt to provide legal cover that would prevent attack by government and environmental groups. First designed in the late seventies, it was a financial loss from the beginning, especially as it was never mass-produced, advertised, or supported beyond a very minimal level. Drivers were forced to lease the EV-1... no one could own one. And when the lease was over, GM took every car back (during a protest, they even denied Jay Leno ownership of one... and he offered $1 mil for it!).

And then GM drove them to a facility in Arizona, where they scrapped each and every one of them. In 2006.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
The initial push for Hybrids here was as a Smog measure to allow zero emission operation for inner city traffic, and gasoline for range out of town.

The Insight takes a different approach running on a small efficient gasoline engine all the time, with a battery/electric motor available as a boost to supplement the engine when more performance is called on. Other than appealing to Hybrid types what is the benefit over a turbo, or diesel, or just having an economical car to begin with.
What is the benefit of an Hybrid over turbocharged compacts or turbodiesel cars? Much better fuel economy in the city for a similar size and power. The VW Polo 1.4 TDI that is one of the most fuel-efficient turbodiesel cars in Europe and it still consumes 22% more than the Prius in city driving (4,9 l/100 Km vs 4,0 l/100 Km) and slightly more than the Insight despite its less complicated hybrid system (4,7 l/100 Km). And the Insight and Prius are both bigger than the Polo and more powerful. There is one diesel that is more efficient in city driving than the Prius and Insight, but that's the Smart car, which is much less of a car than the Prius and Insight. Also, with the hybrid's ability to shut off engine while stopped, this means that in true congestion, it will still be more efficient than those small cars, unless of course the drivers of the small cars manually stop their car's engine whenever they stop.

If you drive only on the highway, an hybrid has only a marginal advantage over a traditional car with a fuel-efficient powertrain, but if you drive in the city then the hybrid makes sense, it makes sense because it recuperates the energy you lose while braking to propulse the car after restarting instead of wasting it by converting it into heat.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
12,348 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
The auto-shutoff on idle is accepted but applies equally to all engines whether in a Hybrid or not.

The Prius does well in traffic because it can shut off the engine completely. That does not seem to be the case with the Insight.

A Prius type Hybrid with an electric only mode can also use plug in recharging which helps.

The case for regenerating braking energy seems to be compromised by the weight of the mechanism. The F1 flywheels were an example.
So the extra weight of the battery/electric motor combination is offset by the recovered braking energy in a comparison with a Turbo setup.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
The auto-shutoff on idle is accepted but applies equally to all engines whether in a Hybrid or not.

The Prius does well in traffic because it can shut off the engine completely. That does not seem to be the case with the Insight.
The Insight does shut-off completely while stopped, that is something all hybrids do, even the Malibu mild hybrid did it. Start-stop systems also are integrated in more and more vehicles in Europe, though they don't call them hybrid because of it. The difference between Honda's and Toyota's systems are that the Honda's system can't move the car only with the electric motor, the motor helps the engine and gives it most of the power at low speed but the engine turns nonetheless. Whereas at low speed, the Prius is moved only by the electric motor.

The case for regenerating braking energy seems to be compromised by the weight of the mechanism. The F1 flywheels were an example.
F1 cars are an extreme case, they're made to be very light (they weigh hundreds of pound less than a Geo Metro, the minimum weight is roughly 1330 lbs) so every pound added to it has more effect than on a car made for common use, and they're working at extremely hard conditions all the time with the center of gravity and handling being extremely susceptible to any change in distribution of weight. I think that the case for regenerative braking for cars is very strong, even the mild system used in the Malibu Hybrid 2009 increased city fuel economy by nearly 20%.
 
1 - 16 of 16 Posts
Top